This chapter was a refresher for me because I learned a lot of these tips while tutoring for writing. Making the conference feel like a conversation is key (Atwell, 224). Most students don’t’ really expect that if they've never had a conference before. I would always be sure to keep the paper in front of them as much as possible, and keep myself leaned away from the paper; I didn't want to look poised to attack. And I would try to put what they were trying to explain in different words, so that the work was still theirs, but they just heard it a bit different. I found it to be extremely rewarding. Patience is the other important factor (Atwell, 226). It could take an hour to improve one sentence, but that could make all the difference.
It never occurred to me to make sure students are having a conference with themselves first. (246). Atwell mentioned that she noticed some of her students were writing and immediately looking for feedback from someone else. If they don’t learn how to make editing decisions independently, they are not going to improve as writers.
Smagorinsky 7: Teaching Extended Definition Essays When I started reading this chapter I felt like it was explaining how to write persuasive pieces. It took me awhile to realize what made this essay different, and why it was actually important. I think writing an essay like this helps students to be sure they are being clear when they are trying to communicate. It forces them to look at a situation in all the different ways, taking in all the different perspectives and understandings. There is a lot to learn from writing an essay in this manner.
I was going through the list of things that people generally go through when developing an extended definition (Smagorinsky, 140-141), and I was wondering if I’ve ever even done something like this. I know I've never really thought it out like that. But I think it’s something we do without really thinking about it. Students may need more guidance in getting to this point. Actually, I think a lot of people need guidance in order to get to the end. Too many people don’t analyze enough when they say something, acting like they know it all when they have left a huge part out. Maybe I’m misunderstanding this still, but I feel like students need to be able to go through these steps in order to not sound ignorant. I think it’s a lesson too many people have missed out on in their education.
The last sentiment of Atwell’s chapter strikes me as the most important part. The only things conferences require, she says, are teachers “who know something worth saying” and approach each student with the question, “How can I help you?” (261). This thought encapsulates what a teacher needs to bring to the table. Expertise about writing is crucial, of course. A student needs to feel confident with your ability as a reader and writer, and he needs to recognize you as someone who can improve his own writing. He also needs to feel that you’re a receptive audience, someone who will help improve his writing, not merely criticize it. When I was in school, I had several teachers with one of those qualities or the other, and often their help felt incomplete. Atwell’s description helped me conceptualize why I felt that way.
Many of the sample conversations Atwell posed were also quite helpful. I particularly liked the scenario she presented in which a student tackled the difficult subject of a mother murdering her child (230-232). This situation is delicate and layered. Atwell needs to help her student with the technical difficulties of his writing, but she also needs to find away to allow him to approach this incredibly touchy subject safely. I thought her response was creative and productive. By suggesting that her student try a new point of view in the poem, she allowed him to face the subject matter in a more artistically interesting manner without sacrificing its power. This example showed the flexibility and creativity a writing teacher needs to have in order to conference well. It also is a concrete example of the importance Atwell places on being a writer and reader herself. She clearly has a deep perspective from having written and read often in her own life, and she was able to apply that deep knowledge here.
Smagorinsky’s chapter was confusing for me at first. I’ve never had to write an extended definition essay, and I’m honestly not sure that I’ve even encountered this idea before. The way the chapter broke it down, however, hammered home the importance of scaffolding. Every student in this hypothetical class probably has a sense of what it means to be dishonest, but it would not serve them well to make them reflect on this concept in a text without preparation. Forcing them to define criteria first and then apply their criteria to situations is a good way to generate thoughts with clarity and concision. It also forces them to reflect on the complexities inherent in situations like this. My only criticism of this chapter is that I would have liked more examples of extended definitions. I understand the framework, but I’d like to see it in action more.
Its hard for me to write a blog post this week because I don’t want to give the more exciting points from my presentation away, so I’ve decided to focus on something that I won’t go into a lot of detail in during class: the fine art of communicating and questioning teenagers according to Nancie Atwell. One of the parenting books I really like is called “How to Talk so Kids Will Listen, and Listen so Kids will Talk.” Atwell is a master at this. Adults are often unsuccessful talking to kids about how their day was never mind something as personal as their writing, so being prepared with ways to approach students is important.
Something that I noticed Atwell models on page 222 is paraphrasing what her student tells her during their conference. By doing this, not only is she signaling to her student “I am listening to you,” but she is giving her student a fresh look at what she is trying to accomplish in her writing. Sometimes when we hear our intentions through someone else’s words we understand them in ways that take us in new directions or help us feel even more focused.
Atwell also points out on page 221 that “waiting and listening are still the hardest parts of conferring for me.” She recognizes that allowing the student to have a voice in the conference is just as important as what the teacher has to say.
On pages 226 through 229 she gives examples of “global questions” that are useful in a variety of writing workshop settings. If we are too specific in our questioning students are apt to answer too briefly. For example, a student might simply say “yes” or “no” if we ask: “did you intend for the mood of this piece to be dark?” However, a student might be more prone to explore their own writing process with a question such as: “What mood where you trying to create in this piece?”
When I first read the title for Smagorinsky’s chapter this week I rolled my eyes a little because there is just something about “Teaching Extended Definition Essays” that seems dry, dry, dry. However, extended definition essays can actually be fun if students are able to define things that are important to them, and this type of essay seems simpler than other, more straightforward, and can therefore segue into other, more complicated forms. I particularly like the honest vs. dishonest activity because it teaches students how to formulate criteria, but it also encourages a conversation that prompts students to think philosophically about how they feel about “moral dilemmas.”
Nancie Atwell begins Chapter Seven of In the Middle (1998) with a quotation from Donald Greaves which says, “We’ll spend a lifetime crafting our teaching in order to allow children to be the authors of their own texts” (p. 217). This sentiment perfectly frames this chapter. As teachers, we must strive to help our students learn how to write in the most comprehendible and accessible ways possible. We must work with students, not against them, in the forms of workshops and conferences in order to help them overcome obstacles in their writing and improve.
Atwell states firmly that “writers are vulnerable” (1998, p. 217). This cannot be a truer statement. As a writer myself, I have had to force myself to overcome my fears of sharing my writing in order to improve my skills in a classroom setting. Writers are possessive and put up walls. Teachers of writing must find a way to reach over these walls in order to help their students. They must do so carefully. For example, one of my high school English teachers gave me a C- on a term paper in my sophomore year and when I went to talk to her about it, she was not open to helping. Instead of telling me how I could improve, she pointed out everything I did wrong without offering solutions. I felt that I was a good writer and I was mostly embarrassed by the fact she thought little of my effort. Atwell suggests teachers should hold conferences during the writing process, not only after the writing takes place (1998). This teaching strategy could have helped me in my sophomore year and therefore I believe it can be an effective teaching strategy I can apply to my own future teaching practices.
In Chapter Seven of The Dynamics of Writing Instruction (2010), Smagorinsky et al. explain how to teaching the process behind writing an extended definition essay. Like the other chapters in this book, they suggest using a “structured process approach” when teaching this skill to students. I particularly like their “define a hero” activity in which students learn how to interact with criteria by defining a hero based on given criteria (2010). From there, students can then apply what they learned to creating their own criteria for defining another concept, providing warrants for these criteria, and then applying knowledge in group writing activities. Learning how to properly define concepts is a skill students will not only use in writing, but also outside of academic activities in their personal lives.
Atwell's chapter on responding to writers struck me as one of the most important that we have read so far, simply because of the fact that "writers are vulnerable," which Atwell mentions (p. 217). It is important to not only know how to speak to your students, but to ask the right questions and listen to your students' ideas. Atwell notes that our job is to show students how they can build on what they already know and what they can do with that knowledge (p. 218). I agree with Atwell's technique of having writing workshops in class versus leaving comments on a 'complete' work. Having workshops in class through the writing process allows students to ask questions that they may have, share their work and receive feedback. Sometimes the process of sharing causes a writer to realize that they may have taken a direction that they didn't intend on taking, or that they haven't quite said what they intended to say. After listening, giving feedback to your students can help guide them down the path that they meant to take in their writing. I also like Atwell's suggestion that during conferences, we should "avoid generalized praise" because it is not praise that is directed at the individual writer or their work - praise should be encouraging and specific (p. 225). Finally, I found the idea of having a writing conference with yourself to be most helpful. Most often writers believe that a work is finished, only to find themselves re-writing after visiting the work again at a later time. Having a conference with yourself as the writer encourages thoughtful decision making and revision during the writing process, not after. Having students keep a copy of "Having a Writing Conference With Yourself" in their daily writing folders is a great way to see that they go back and revisit their work before declaring it complete (p.247).
The first thing I thought of when I began reading the chapter on teaching extended definition essays was the standardized test - I couldn't recall any other time where I may have had to write a piece like this. According to Smagorinsky, et. al, an extended definition is the result of "more explicit and more detailed criteria" (p.140). If teachers are going to teach extended definition essays in the classroom, I think that scaffolding the procedures for writing extended definitions is the best approach, as outlined in the chapter. Once students are able to comprehend what criteria are, they can move on to creating their own criteria for new concepts/problems. The idea of having students share their ideas and receive immediate feedback from their peers is critical - when experimenting with new definitions of concepts, we want students to use language that is appropriate to a wide audience. Having a class discussion about their ideas "channels their thinking toward culturally appropriate definitions" (p.145).
I have to admit that when I was in high school I did have one single conference. My teachers often assumed that since I was smart or because I was doing well that I was capable of continuing on my own. During my particularly rebellious years, I didn’t have a problem with this but during my freshmen and senior years I wish I had had someone to sit down with and really talk about my education. Freshman year was filled with unexplained grades and natural instincts. Senior year was filled with questions of what came next. Though conferences with teachers may not have been the answer to everything, it would have been nice to know that my teachers cared about my education, welfare, and future. I did not get that feeling from my high school teachers and as a teacher I would like to show my students that I care and that my door is always open. I think one of the biggest concerns I have is what students will bring to conferences. I fear that students will bring problems or concerns that I cannot address or help them with. Similarly, I’m also afraid that they will come with questions that I cannot answer and though I recognize that I am not an all-knowing being, I think some students have that belief.
I found the examples in Atwell useful. They really helped me imagine theoretical conferences and what kinds of problems may arise during these conferences. I want to be able to help my students with any problems they may have. I have tutored several students over the years with writing and specific assignments so I feel confident that I can help my students with their academic work. I worry about the personal problems or the home problems that my students may bring to me. I hope that I am capable of doing the right thing and giving the right kind of advice if any advice is even needed. I also worry because the lines of what is appropriate and what isn’t is so limiting. I worry that a student that really needs my help won’t be able to get it because of political correctness or school appropriateness. I understand the reason for such defined lines between school and not-school but I worry that I won’t be able to navigate them safely and successfully.
In Atwell’s chapter on “Responding to Readers and Reading” I love the idea of reading journals. The way she describes the journal as a way to write down thoughts and share them with others seems like a really great way to gage students understanding of what they are reading. By making it interactive with their peers, friends, and the teacher, students can get feedback on their ideas from others and also give a response if they like. I really like how Atwell outlines her expectations right away with the first “entry” into each journal, writing the students a letter laying down the expectations and rules for the reading journal. Atwell states that she, “can observe patterns in their growth over time… I report to their parents at the end of each grading period…” (Atwell, 1998, p. 297). These journals can track the reading that students do and give a concrete piece of work to view about what they read and what they took from the readings and what they liked. For teachers and parents to see this is a great way to learn about the student and see what they are capable of.
In Smagorinsky’s chapter on “Teaching Extended Definition Essays” the section on applying knowledge of procedures in collaborative writing was extremely informative for me. Although the whole chapter lays out the concept, this section talked about working in small groups before working independently. I have never actually done this in a class, but after reviewing the two examples, it seems like it is extremely beneficial for students. Working through ideas with someone else is always helpful because you can hear a new point of view and build on your own ideas. I can recall a few different cases in high school where this would have been a great help, especially when it came to writing history papers. Smagorinsky gives two great examples of how this helps students. Working in groups and sharing information with the entire class gives students so many different ideas that they may not have thought about alone.
Atwell 7: Responding to Writers and Writing
ReplyDeleteThis chapter was a refresher for me because I learned a lot of these tips while tutoring for writing. Making the conference feel like a conversation is key (Atwell, 224). Most students don’t’ really expect that if they've never had a conference before. I would always be sure to keep the paper in front of them as much as possible, and keep myself leaned away from the paper; I didn't want to look poised to attack. And I would try to put what they were trying to explain in different words, so that the work was still theirs, but they just heard it a bit different. I found it to be extremely rewarding. Patience is the other important factor (Atwell, 226). It could take an hour to improve one sentence, but that could make all the difference.
It never occurred to me to make sure students are having a conference with themselves first. (246). Atwell mentioned that she noticed some of her students were writing and immediately looking for feedback from someone else. If they don’t learn how to make editing decisions independently, they are not going to improve as writers.
Smagorinsky 7: Teaching Extended Definition Essays
When I started reading this chapter I felt like it was explaining how to write persuasive pieces. It took me awhile to realize what made this essay different, and why it was actually important. I think writing an essay like this helps students to be sure they are being clear when they are trying to communicate. It forces them to look at a situation in all the different ways, taking in all the different perspectives and understandings. There is a lot to learn from writing an essay in this manner.
I was going through the list of things that people generally go through when developing an extended definition (Smagorinsky, 140-141), and I was wondering if I’ve ever even done something like this. I know I've never really thought it out like that. But I think it’s something we do without really thinking about it. Students may need more guidance in getting to this point. Actually, I think a lot of people need guidance in order to get to the end. Too many people don’t analyze enough when they say something, acting like they know it all when they have left a huge part out. Maybe I’m misunderstanding this still, but I feel like students need to be able to go through these steps in order to not sound ignorant. I think it’s a lesson too many people have missed out on in their education.
The last sentiment of Atwell’s chapter strikes me as the most important part. The only things conferences require, she says, are teachers “who know something worth saying” and approach each student with the question, “How can I help you?” (261). This thought encapsulates what a teacher needs to bring to the table. Expertise about writing is crucial, of course. A student needs to feel confident with your ability as a reader and writer, and he needs to recognize you as someone who can improve his own writing. He also needs to feel that you’re a receptive audience, someone who will help improve his writing, not merely criticize it. When I was in school, I had several teachers with one of those qualities or the other, and often their help felt incomplete. Atwell’s description helped me conceptualize why I felt that way.
ReplyDeleteMany of the sample conversations Atwell posed were also quite helpful. I particularly liked the scenario she presented in which a student tackled the difficult subject of a mother murdering her child (230-232). This situation is delicate and layered. Atwell needs to help her student with the technical difficulties of his writing, but she also needs to find away to allow him to approach this incredibly touchy subject safely. I thought her response was creative and productive. By suggesting that her student try a new point of view in the poem, she allowed him to face the subject matter in a more artistically interesting manner without sacrificing its power. This example showed the flexibility and creativity a writing teacher needs to have in order to conference well. It also is a concrete example of the importance Atwell places on being a writer and reader herself. She clearly has a deep perspective from having written and read often in her own life, and she was able to apply that deep knowledge here.
Smagorinsky’s chapter was confusing for me at first. I’ve never had to write an extended definition essay, and I’m honestly not sure that I’ve even encountered this idea before. The way the chapter broke it down, however, hammered home the importance of scaffolding. Every student in this hypothetical class probably has a sense of what it means to be dishonest, but it would not serve them well to make them reflect on this concept in a text without preparation. Forcing them to define criteria first and then apply their criteria to situations is a good way to generate thoughts with clarity and concision. It also forces them to reflect on the complexities inherent in situations like this. My only criticism of this chapter is that I would have liked more examples of extended definitions. I understand the framework, but I’d like to see it in action more.
ReplyDeleteIts hard for me to write a blog post this week because I don’t want to give the more exciting points from my presentation away, so I’ve decided to focus on something that I won’t go into a lot of detail in during class: the fine art of communicating and questioning teenagers according to Nancie Atwell. One of the parenting books I really like is called “How to Talk so Kids Will Listen, and Listen so Kids will Talk.” Atwell is a master at this. Adults are often unsuccessful talking to kids about how their day was never mind something as personal as their writing, so being prepared with ways to approach students is important.
Something that I noticed Atwell models on page 222 is paraphrasing what her student tells her during their conference. By doing this, not only is she signaling to her student “I am listening to you,” but she is giving her student a fresh look at what she is trying to accomplish in her writing. Sometimes when we hear our intentions through someone else’s words we understand them in ways that take us in new directions or help us feel even more focused.
Atwell also points out on page 221 that “waiting and listening are still the hardest parts of conferring for me.” She recognizes that allowing the student to have a voice in the conference is just as important as what the teacher has to say.
On pages 226 through 229 she gives examples of “global questions” that are useful in a variety of writing workshop settings. If we are too specific in our questioning students are apt to answer too briefly. For example, a student might simply say “yes” or “no” if we ask: “did you intend for the mood of this piece to be dark?” However, a student might be more prone to explore their own writing process with a question such as: “What mood where you trying to create in this piece?”
When I first read the title for Smagorinsky’s chapter this week I rolled my eyes a little because there is just something about “Teaching Extended Definition Essays” that seems dry, dry, dry. However, extended definition essays can actually be fun if students are able to define things that are important to them, and this type of essay seems simpler than other, more straightforward, and can therefore segue into other, more complicated forms. I particularly like the honest vs. dishonest activity because it teaches students how to formulate criteria, but it also encourages a conversation that prompts students to think philosophically about how they feel about “moral dilemmas.”
Nancie Atwell begins Chapter Seven of In the Middle (1998) with a quotation from Donald Greaves which says, “We’ll spend a lifetime crafting our teaching in order to allow children to be the authors of their own texts” (p. 217). This sentiment perfectly frames this chapter. As teachers, we must strive to help our students learn how to write in the most comprehendible and accessible ways possible. We must work with students, not against them, in the forms of workshops and conferences in order to help them overcome obstacles in their writing and improve.
ReplyDeleteAtwell states firmly that “writers are vulnerable” (1998, p. 217). This cannot be a truer statement. As a writer myself, I have had to force myself to overcome my fears of sharing my writing in order to improve my skills in a classroom setting. Writers are possessive and put up walls. Teachers of writing must find a way to reach over these walls in order to help their students. They must do so carefully. For example, one of my high school English teachers gave me a C- on a term paper in my sophomore year and when I went to talk to her about it, she was not open to helping. Instead of telling me how I could improve, she pointed out everything I did wrong without offering solutions. I felt that I was a good writer and I was mostly embarrassed by the fact she thought little of my effort. Atwell suggests teachers should hold conferences during the writing process, not only after the writing takes place (1998). This teaching strategy could have helped me in my sophomore year and therefore I believe it can be an effective teaching strategy I can apply to my own future teaching practices.
In Chapter Seven of The Dynamics of Writing Instruction (2010), Smagorinsky et al. explain how to teaching the process behind writing an extended definition essay. Like the other chapters in this book, they suggest using a “structured process approach” when teaching this skill to students. I particularly like their “define a hero” activity in which students learn how to interact with criteria by defining a hero based on given criteria (2010). From there, students can then apply what they learned to creating their own criteria for defining another concept, providing warrants for these criteria, and then applying knowledge in group writing activities. Learning how to properly define concepts is a skill students will not only use in writing, but also outside of academic activities in their personal lives.
Atwell's chapter on responding to writers struck me as one of the most important that we have read so far, simply because of the fact that "writers are vulnerable," which Atwell mentions (p. 217). It is important to not only know how to speak to your students, but to ask the right questions and listen to your students' ideas. Atwell notes that our job is to show students how they can build on what they already know and what they can do with that knowledge (p. 218). I agree with Atwell's technique of having writing workshops in class versus leaving comments on a 'complete' work. Having workshops in class through the writing process allows students to ask questions that they may have, share their work and receive feedback. Sometimes the process of sharing causes a writer to realize that they may have taken a direction that they didn't intend on taking, or that they haven't quite said what they intended to say. After listening, giving feedback to your students can help guide them down the path that they meant to take in their writing. I also like Atwell's suggestion that during conferences, we should "avoid generalized praise" because it is not praise that is directed at the individual writer or their work - praise should be encouraging and specific (p. 225). Finally, I found the idea of having a writing conference with yourself to be most helpful. Most often writers believe that a work is finished, only to find themselves re-writing after visiting the work again at a later time. Having a conference with yourself as the writer encourages thoughtful decision making and revision during the writing process, not after. Having students keep a copy of "Having a Writing Conference With Yourself" in their daily writing folders is a great way to see that they go back and revisit their work before declaring it complete (p.247).
ReplyDeleteThe first thing I thought of when I began reading the chapter on teaching extended definition essays was the standardized test - I couldn't recall any other time where I may have had to write a piece like this. According to Smagorinsky, et. al, an extended definition is the result of "more explicit and more detailed criteria" (p.140). If teachers are going to teach extended definition essays in the classroom, I think that scaffolding the procedures for writing extended definitions is the best approach, as outlined in the chapter. Once students are able to comprehend what criteria are, they can move on to creating their own criteria for new concepts/problems. The idea of having students share their ideas and receive immediate feedback from their peers is critical - when experimenting with new definitions of concepts, we want students to use language that is appropriate to a wide audience. Having a class discussion about their ideas "channels their thinking toward culturally appropriate definitions" (p.145).
A Conference on Conferences
ReplyDeleteI have to admit that when I was in high school I did have one single conference. My teachers often assumed that since I was smart or because I was doing well that I was capable of continuing on my own. During my particularly rebellious years, I didn’t have a problem with this but during my freshmen and senior years I wish I had had someone to sit down with and really talk about my education. Freshman year was filled with unexplained grades and natural instincts. Senior year was filled with questions of what came next. Though conferences with teachers may not have been the answer to everything, it would have been nice to know that my teachers cared about my education, welfare, and future. I did not get that feeling from my high school teachers and as a teacher I would like to show my students that I care and that my door is always open. I think one of the biggest concerns I have is what students will bring to conferences. I fear that students will bring problems or concerns that I cannot address or help them with. Similarly, I’m also afraid that they will come with questions that I cannot answer and though I recognize that I am not an all-knowing being, I think some students have that belief.
I found the examples in Atwell useful. They really helped me imagine theoretical conferences and what kinds of problems may arise during these conferences. I want to be able to help my students with any problems they may have. I have tutored several students over the years with writing and specific assignments so I feel confident that I can help my students with their academic work. I worry about the personal problems or the home problems that my students may bring to me. I hope that I am capable of doing the right thing and giving the right kind of advice if any advice is even needed. I also worry because the lines of what is appropriate and what isn’t is so limiting. I worry that a student that really needs my help won’t be able to get it because of political correctness or school appropriateness. I understand the reason for such defined lines between school and not-school but I worry that I won’t be able to navigate them safely and successfully.
In Atwell’s chapter on “Responding to Readers and Reading” I love the idea of reading journals. The way she describes the journal as a way to write down thoughts and share them with others seems like a really great way to gage students understanding of what they are reading. By making it interactive with their peers, friends, and the teacher, students can get feedback on their ideas from others and also give a response if they like. I really like how Atwell outlines her expectations right away with the first “entry” into each journal, writing the students a letter laying down the expectations and rules for the reading journal. Atwell states that she, “can observe patterns in their growth over time… I report to their parents at the end of each grading period…” (Atwell, 1998, p. 297). These journals can track the reading that students do and give a concrete piece of work to view about what they read and what they took from the readings and what they liked. For teachers and parents to see this is a great way to learn about the student and see what they are capable of.
ReplyDeleteIn Smagorinsky’s chapter on “Teaching Extended Definition Essays” the section on applying knowledge of procedures in collaborative writing was extremely informative for me. Although the whole chapter lays out the concept, this section talked about working in small groups before working independently. I have never actually done this in a class, but after reviewing the two examples, it seems like it is extremely beneficial for students. Working through ideas with someone else is always helpful because you can hear a new point of view and build on your own ideas. I can recall a few different cases in high school where this would have been a great help, especially when it came to writing history papers. Smagorinsky gives two great examples of how this helps students. Working in groups and sharing information with the entire class gives students so many different ideas that they may not have thought about alone.